Hello!
I am looking for a beginners'tutorial, but they describe a battle or catch-them-all game and I was looking for some variety of topics. Probably something dialogue based (that's what I intend to make) with no battles but lots of NPC and dialogue interaction to attain a goal.
I searched for links online and I watched some videos, but I am stuck at the part where they begin introducing enemy action.
Beginner tutorial without battle?
Asked Answered
Jahvist It's unlikely that you're going to find a tutorial that covers everything you want to implement in your game. You'll need to break the vision down into smaller parts and search how those can be done separately.
Hi Erich_L.
I am prepared to search part by part and try to see what works so I can learn and make the game, but I can't go far. However, at some point in every tutorial there are scripts and codes for battles or platforming and things don't work well if I skip that part. That's why I asked if there are games with no battles. I found some tutorials about visual novels, but this is not exactly what I had in mind.
You either learn how to code or you make your game, you can't do both at the same time.
Complete the tutorial to learn, once you've learned you can move on to more advanced topics and do whatever game YOU want.
The goal of a tutorial is to teach you the basics of programming and familiarize yourself with the engine, not to be a blueprint for any particular genre. What you learn (signals, variables, functions, arrays) will be useful in any game.
I tried this approach. Learn first, make game later. Although this is not how I usually learn. I need to practice immediately what I learn. This is why I was stuck, because I never learn without implementing it immediately in a separate project.
Anyway, I found 4-5 great tutorials (all about shooting aliens and looting zombies and platforming, but nothing else is there) and I will imitate their game styles before I make mine.
I hope it will work.
What I am now very anxious about, is that I probably chose the wrong engine, because I only see specific kinds of games.
Jahvist I found 4-5 great tutorials (all about shooting aliens and looting zombies and platforming, but nothing else is there) and I will imitate their game styles before I make mine.
Most tutorials are about zombies and shooting and platforming because those things are easy to code and easy to understand, and most games are like that.
You have these forums to ask about specific questions, and we will try to help, but you have to be specific, you have to put some work into breaking down the mechanics of the game you want to make.
Jahvist Probably something dialogue based (that's what I intend to make)
First thing you have to do is think of what the final game should look like. You can write it down in a piece of paper. It can be something completely original, or easier, something based on an existing game.
Ex: You talk to people, they give you quests, you fetch items.
Or: A FIFA inspired game, a simcity inspired game, etc.
Jahvist with no battles but lots of NPC and dialogue interaction to attain a goal.
What you describe can be partly coded from a shooter or RPG. Interacting with NPCs is no different from interacting with enemies. Data is Data, HEALTH and DMG is just replaced with different scores like "quest ticks" and "relationship bars". These are all tools, the game you make depends on how you use them.
Again, we have no idea what you are thinking, we can only guess. It doesn't seem like YOU know what you want, and this is normal, games start as ideas. You have to sit down and think about the game and the specifics first, this is one of the most important steps.
Jahvist What I am now very anxious about, is that I probably chose the wrong engine, because I only see specific kinds of games.
The engine is a tool. You see "specific kinds of games" for reasons. Small games are easier for indie devs, others make the games they want, which are commonly shooters and RPGs, and you don't see "AAA" highest of quality games in godot because those are expensive, with thousands of people working on them, and companies have usually chosen unreal and to some extent unity for those. Most of the godot users are indie devs and hobbyists, but while there are many games that seem conventional, I have also seen less conventional ones, like:
A 4X strategy game, many puzzle solving games, a pokemon game, and a dialog based RPG with no combat.
If you take a look at channels like StayAtHomeGames, you will see that many godot games are unconventional:
https://www.youtube.com/@stayathomedev
Whatever engine you choose, you WILL have to learn it, and it will take just as much effort. I can tell you as someone who's worked on GameMaker, then BGE, then Unity, and recently Godot. All engines are the same, they have perks and issues, but if you know how to code there is nothing you can't do.
Cohesive Interacting with NPCs is no different from interacting with enemies. Data is Data, HEALTH and DMG is just replaced with different scores like "quest ticks" and "relationship bars".
This is helpful. I didn't even make the connection in my mind! I was too focussed on the coding part. Starting by this, I can now "see" how the tutorials I have could help me.
Cohesive It doesn't seem like YOU know what you want,
I want 4 weeks of holidays 🙂 but that's not on topic.
I intended to make a learning game. I have it planned and researched. I miss some art but it will come. The person must acquire X amount of knowledge but I want it to be playful, as in "learn the words by doing the shopping". It shouldn't be too childish either, so I need NPC but I must not kill them or steal their weapons with fireballs 😉
Cohesive don't see "AAA" highest of quality games
I've played a lot of AAA that were actually AA by "big" engines, this doesn't worry me about Godot at all.
Cohesive and a dialog based RPG with no combat
I will research that. Sounds almost like what I'd need.
Cohesive If you take a look at channels like StayAtHomeGames, you will see that many godot games are unconventional:
https://www.youtube.com/@stayathomedev
I will have a look.
Thank you.
There are 2 or 3 addons in the godot asset library for RPG dialog. Thou I am in godot 4 and haven't tried any, you might want to take a look. It's the fourth button at the top of the editor next to 2D, 3D and Script.
Lambency You have to be aware of one possibly unpleasant fact. Using an engine won't absolve you from doing quite a bit of "boring" programming work. Games are complex software thingies and cannot be made without a lot of coding, even if you employ an engine to handle all low level technical stuff.
If you're serious about programming a game, your learning time would be best invested into general purpose programming course, not directly related to games. General programming knowledge can be applied to solve all kinds of problems you typically encounter when making a game, freeing you from a need to constantly seek narrowly focused tutorials.
On the other hand, if you're primarily interested in visual and game design side, best to team up with a programmer.
Kean Well there is Game Maker Studio 2 and ClickTeam Fusion (wouldn't recommend that) which allow you to create games without programming. But I read that those sometimes can be somewhat limited if you want to create more complex things.
Lambency Here is a beginner tutorial that explains the basics of programming with Godot. I think it is well made for beginners without any programming experience (his other videos are really good too, but usually require some basic programming knowledge).
There is also a video about creating UIs in Godot, which later might be helpful for your dialogues if you decide to make them by yourself (and not use any addons). But you won't find anything about interaction with npcs there.
Currently only part 1 is available:
Somehow this channel became my number 1 recommendation for Godot tutorials 😄
Homestretch allow you to create games without programming
It's impossible to make a game without programming. "Without programming" is just a phrase typically used for various forms of non-text based scripting, which is just another way of programming and a pretty tedious way if you need to do anything but trivial stuff. We could say that Godot 3.x with its visual scripting lets you "make games without programming", but we all know how visual scripting ended up in 4.x. That's pretty much the testament to its usefulness and popularity.
Of course, there are systems that let you produce cookie cutter stuff of one sort or another without much effort, like Shmup Creator or RPG Maker, but those are essentially toys.
I'll repeat my usual mantra here. Don't make your first programming steps with a game engine. It'll confuse the hell out of you and you'll end up in a messy place knowledge wise, regardless of how gentle and friendly the tutorials are. Do an introductory Python course instead, or any other language that lets you execute programs from a command line.
Kean Don't make your first programming steps with a game engine.
Homestretch Here is a beginner tutorial that explains the basics of programming with Godot.
It is simple but also detailed. It is a good introduction.Thank you.
Kean o an introductory Python course instead, or any other language that lets you execute programs from a command line.
I tried some "easy " languages years ago, I didn't get past step 2 in any of them. The only thing I managed was website stuff.
Therefore, I am not very eager to try programming again. I'd rather use an engine with a language that can be learned and understood easily enough. I don't plan to build anything AAA, just a simple game for my purposes.
Arsenite Learn GDScript From Zero
Nice one.
Homestretch But you won't find anything about interaction with npcs there.
I found a couple of videos on youtube like this:
and this tutorial here: https://dev.to/christinec_dev/lets-learn-godot-4-by-making-an-rpg-part-17-basic-npc-quest-2f8b
I found lots of other ones but they were made for 3.
I looked at the zenva courses, but they have battles etc, not much on npc. At least they help with world building.
I think I will go with 2d clearly, I don't like the feel of it but 3d is too complicated.
Thank you all! 🙂
Jahvist I'd rather use an engine with a language that can be learned and understood easily enough.
You're in the right place. GDScript is just such a language and can be the first language to learn.
Jahvist The person must acquire X amount of knowledge but I want it to be playful, as in "learn the words by doing the shopping"
What you are describing is completely in line with a visual novel. Why aren't lessons on them appropriate?
Arsenite What you are describing is completely in line with a visual novel. Why aren't lessons on them appropriate?
I started with visual novel systems and they are good for branching scenarios but I didn't find any way to include character progression (''better knowledge level --> better house'' for example). Only one goal to achieve.
It's not about the language. GDScript is an excellent beginner language. However, learning to program within an engine environment is not the best way to go. The instant you start, you're faced with advanced concepts like objects, virtual functions, callbacks, "simultaneously" executing multiple programs, engine architecture and all hardware accelerated graphics stuff. You don't want any of this in your way when learning what a loop or a list is. If you're a total beginner, the engine's imposing "presence" will distract you from focusing on actual programming fundamentals. In fact it may make it very hard to even discern between programming fundamentals and mere engine technicalities, especially when the stuff is presented in a form of "easy to follow" tutorials.
Jahvist but I didn't find any way to include character progression
Yeah, that's probably the problem. You can borrow this element from other lessons, although it is a bit problematic for a beginner.
Kean You don't want any of this in your way when learning what a loop or a list is. If you're a total beginner, the engine's imposing "presence" will distract you from focusing on actual programming fundamentals.
In part, it makes sense. But this argument is somewhat debatable. It is good, along with learning the programming itself, to have an idea of how to apply it in your work. If the learning process is properly organized, it can be a great bonus.
When students study programming, usually (at least in our country, I don't know how it is in wild countries) they study many other subjects in parallel. In this case — yep — attention can be scattered. But an adult usually studies only the things he/she needs. And, although, as an adult, it is usually difficult to keep attention on a multitude of subjects, but the number of subjects to be studied is small and quite allows to control attention.
But a good course on GDScript for beginners, of course, is necessary.
Arsenite wild countries
What are wild countries? 🤔 Wild west?
Homestretch Wild west?
Something like that. 🔫
Arsenite Now I'm curious if my country is a wild country too. Sorry for the offtopic.
Homestretch Now I'm curious if my country is a wild country too. Sorry for the offtopic.
All countries have gone feral, to one degree or another. We live at the end of civilization.There is no country that would be a model now. But this is a political topic, unfortunately.
Arsenite It is good, along with learning the programming itself, to have an idea of how to apply it in your work.
Definitely. But game programming is somewhat peculiar in this regard. I think it's better to learn and apply programming basics with something a bit more "boring". Because people get way over-excited about making games, often forgetting it's still just plain old software development, best done by nerds with computer science degrees. Beginners are all too pumped up to produce something flashy asap and just go after quick fixes promised by how to tutorials. The actual fundamental knowledge, essential for solving problems on your own, is completely tossed away when "learning" like this. In the long run this leads to disappointment. Making a whole game without solid problem solving skills is a very arduous task. This finally results in - quitting. As with every discipline, you need to truly love the "boring" fundamentals in order to become competent enough to produce "exciting" stuff.
Kean I think it's better to learn and apply programming basics with something a bit more "boring".
I will cite an unquestioned authority and respond with a quote from him:
Conversely, I think this book is applicable to non-game software too. I could just as well have called this book More Design Patterns, but I think games make for more engaging examples. Do you really want to read yet another book about employee records and bank accounts?
Kean Making a whole game without solid problem solving skills is a very arduous task.
I would call that "Impossible."
Arsenite It's just a marketing device to sell more books by putting it in the "cool" gamedev context 🙂. Design patterns are abstractions. People who are interested in learning about them are definitely not beginners and they probably couldn't care less how "engaging" the examples are.
Btw this is not a very good book on design patterns. It just took a few of classic patterns from Gamma/Helm/Johnson/Vlissides and described them in a sort of messy way. If you're really interested in DP, better go straight to the source, although this type of strict oo thinking is lately fallen out of vogue somewhat.
Kean It's just a marketing device to sell more books by putting it in the "cool" gamedev context
A marketing device not at the very beginning of the introduction? I guess they'll only stumble upon it when they start reading the book.
It just took a few of classic patterns from Gamma/Helm/Johnson/Vlissides and described them in a sort of messy way.
The book may be confusing against the original, but it is well translated into a language that is native to me. And I couldn't find a translation of the original. Although, my case is not indicative and, unfortunately, English should be learned... even before learning programming.
But the fact that creating games allows you to keep your interest in learning programming when you can see the result at once is very inspiring. And protects from burnout at the initial stage.
Homestretch What are wild countries?
Abandonment of traditional values.
Affine Abandonment of traditional values.
It's more the other way around. A search for greatness in the past, nostalgia and hopeless attempts to bring back the old days. A return to tradition. And, by inertia, further into the archaic.
Arsenite A marketing device not at the very beginning of the introduction?
It's on the website, lol.
I guess having this book on design patterns is better than having no book, if this topic piques your interest.
A brief rant:
when tutorials say "from scratch" or "step-by-step" etc, they shouldn't introduce ready-made scenes, because we can't watch the progress and we can't see the logic. If you say from scratch but then expect me to either find an asset online or create it in another application, then it is not from scratch. "Import the whole thing from a zip and then follow along" is not from scratch.
Tutorial makers should say "this is about coding the movement of a character" not "creating a character from scratch".
If I want a tutorial with ready-made assets, I pick a tutorial with ready-made assets.
If I want to see exactly how it should be created, tell me that and let me drown or swim.
Also, wow, the changes from 3 to 4.2 are enormous! They seem to have reducted a lot of things.
Arsenite when you can see the result at once
I agree with that in every context of learning: learn by practicing little chunks of what you know, but only undertake a big project when you are ready. If you just learn and learn and learn, it will be empty knowledge.
Kean just a marketing device
That's an acceptable practice, unless the whole thing is just a pitch for something else. I haven't read the book, but I have seen a lot of books that are just pure marketing for a class or a webinar or another service and it is very frustrating.
If there is value in the product, marketing is ok and I'd say necessary. If the product itself is the marketing, then...hm.
Jahvist Also, wow, the changes from 3 to 4.2 are enormous! They seem to have reducted a lot of things.
They're not that drastic but if you're a beginner following a tutorial, it's best to stick to the exact version the tutorial is using. Otherwise the changes you're not aware of can cause you a lot of headache, to the point that you'll likely quite the tutorial.
Kean They're not that drastic
The changes are extensive, especially for a beginner who doesn't know how to distinguish his own mistake from a feature change.
Jahvist when tutorials say "from scratch" or "step-by-step" etc, they shouldn't introduce ready-made scenes, because we can't watch the progress and we can't see the logic. If you say from scratch but then expect me to either find an asset online or create it in another application, then it is not from scratch. "Import the whole thing from a zip and then follow along" is not from scratch.
Depends. But tutorials have levels, they are targeted to people at different stages. If I see a tutorial on animations in blender but it goes through the process of modeling the character and rigging it I tend to get annoyed because that's not what I'm looking for, I already know how to do that.
Other tutorials have episodes, where they do all this process in the first "episodes" so they can get it out of the way and get to the more advanced stuff.
Another very important thing you need to do is study those files and the code, you will learn much this way. A lot of begginers just type the same header without knowing what it does because it's required, but knowing what everything does will allow you to write your own code and do different things. Always keep the docs around to look out functions and variables and what they are supposed to do.
Jahvist the changes from 3 to 4.2 are enormous! They seem to have reducted a lot of things.
4.2 has SEVERAL improvements over 3, the issue is it's still in development. Godot 3 is the stable version that you use if you need something done soon, 4.2 is for long term projects. It is faster, has more features for 3D and data stuff and editor usability, but it tends to throw errors and crash more often, which should be fixed over the next couple releases.
Cohesive A lot of begginers just type the same header without knowing what it does because it's required
Exactly! I want to see how it goes step by step, to try it out and see what it does on my own screen. So I pick "beginner/noob/absolute beginner" tutorials on how to add the character and it says add this because of this reason and add that because of that reason, everything goes smoothly and, out of the blue, I find myself in the middle of an animation code without steps 4 to 36, just with a bunch of imported assets!
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