Why can't decimal numbers be represented exactly in binary?
Asked Answered
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There have been several questions posted to SO about floating-point representation. For example, the decimal number 0.1 doesn't have an exact binary representation, so it's dangerous to use the == operator to compare it to another floating-point number. I understand the principles behind floating-point representation.

What I don't understand is why, from a mathematical perspective, are the numbers to the right of the decimal point any more "special" that the ones to the left?

For example, the number 61.0 has an exact binary representation because the integral portion of any number is always exact. But the number 6.10 is not exact. All I did was move the decimal one place and suddenly I've gone from Exactopia to Inexactville. Mathematically, there should be no intrinsic difference between the two numbers -- they're just numbers.

By contrast, if I move the decimal one place in the other direction to produce the number 610, I'm still in Exactopia. I can keep going in that direction (6100, 610000000, 610000000000000) and they're still exact, exact, exact. But as soon as the decimal crosses some threshold, the numbers are no longer exact.

What's going on?

Edit: to clarify, I want to stay away from discussion about industry-standard representations, such as IEEE, and stick with what I believe is the mathematically "pure" way. In base 10, the positional values are:

... 1000  100   10    1   1/10  1/100 ...

In binary, they would be:

... 8    4    2    1    1/2  1/4  1/8 ...

There are also no arbitrary limits placed on these numbers. The positions increase indefinitely to the left and to the right.

Cornstarch answered 6/7, 2009 at 20:17 Comment(5)
You might find this helpful to understand exactly what's going on inside a floating point nubmber: Anatomy of a floating point number.Farra
In binary, the number 3 is represented as 2¹+2°=2+1. Nice and easy. Now, take a look at 1/3. How would you represent that, using negative powers of 2? Experiment a little and you'll see that 1/3 equals the sum of the infinite sequence 2^-2 + 2^-4 + 2^-6 + 2^-8 + ..., ie. not that easy to represent exact in binary.Laynelayney
Jon Skeet answers the question in your body very well. One thing that is missing is that you actually ask two different questions. The title question is "why can't decimal numbers be represented exactly in binary?" The answer is, they can be. Between your title and body you conflate the idea of "binary" and the idea of a "floating point representation." Floating point is a way of expressing decimal numbers in a fixed number of binary digits at the cost of precision. Binary is just a different base for counting and can express any number decimal can, given an infinite number of digits.Anthocyanin
There's several systems that have exact decimal representation. It works pretty much like you describe. The SQL decimal type is one example. LISP languages have it built in. There are several commercial and opensource libraries for using exact decimal calculations. It's just that there's no hardware support for this, and just most languages and hardware out there implements the IEEE standards for representing an infinite amount of numbers in 32 or 64 bits.Carmon
This question appears to be off-topic because it is about Math (even if it's programming related math) and would be better on MathematicsDraughty
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394

Decimal numbers can be represented exactly, if you have enough space - just not by floating binary point numbers. If you use a floating decimal point type (e.g. System.Decimal in .NET) then plenty of values which can't be represented exactly in binary floating point can be exactly represented.

Let's look at it another way - in base 10 which you're likely to be comfortable with, you can't express 1/3 exactly. It's 0.3333333... (recurring). The reason you can't represent 0.1 as a binary floating point number is for exactly the same reason. You can represent 3, and 9, and 27 exactly - but not 1/3, 1/9 or 1/27.

The problem is that 3 is a prime number which isn't a factor of 10. That's not an issue when you want to multiply a number by 3: you can always multiply by an integer without running into problems. But when you divide by a number which is prime and isn't a factor of your base, you can run into trouble (and will do so if you try to divide 1 by that number).

Although 0.1 is usually used as the simplest example of an exact decimal number which can't be represented exactly in binary floating point, arguably 0.2 is a simpler example as it's 1/5 - and 5 is the prime that causes problems between decimal and binary.


Side note to deal with the problem of finite representations:

Some floating decimal point types have a fixed size like System.Decimal others like java.math.BigDecimal are "arbitrarily large" - but they'll hit a limit at some point, whether it's system memory or the theoretical maximum size of an array. This is an entirely separate point to the main one of this answer, however. Even if you had a genuinely arbitrarily large number of bits to play with, you still couldn't represent decimal 0.1 exactly in a floating binary point representation. Compare that with the other way round: given an arbitrary number of decimal digits, you can exactly represent any number which is exactly representable as a floating binary point.

Christinachristine answered 6/7, 2009 at 20:19 Comment(0)
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For example, the number 61.0 has an exact binary representation because the integral portion of any number is always exact. But the number 6.10 is not exact. All I did was move the decimal one place and suddenly I've gone from Exactopia to Inexactville. Mathematically, there should be no intrinsic difference between the two numbers -- they're just numbers.

Let's step away for a moment from the particulars of bases 10 and 2. Let's ask - in base b, what numbers have terminating representations, and what numbers don't? A moment's thought tells us that a number x has a terminating b-representation if and only if there exists an integer n such that x b^n is an integer.

So, for example, x = 11/500 has a terminating 10-representation, because we can pick n = 3 and then x b^n = 22, an integer. However x = 1/3 does not, because whatever n we pick we will not be able to get rid of the 3.

This second example prompts us to think about factors, and we can see that for any rational x = p/q (assumed to be in lowest terms), we can answer the question by comparing the prime factorisations of b and q. If q has any prime factors not in the prime factorisation of b, we will never be able to find a suitable n to get rid of these factors.

Thus for base 10, any p/q where q has prime factors other than 2 or 5 will not have a terminating representation.

So now going back to bases 10 and 2, we see that any rational with a terminating 10-representation will be of the form p/q exactly when q has only 2s and 5s in its prime factorisation; and that same number will have a terminating 2-representatiion exactly when q has only 2s in its prime factorisation.

But one of these cases is a subset of the other! Whenever

q has only 2s in its prime factorisation

it obviously is also true that

q has only 2s and 5s in its prime factorisation

or, put another way, whenever p/q has a terminating 2-representation, p/q has a terminating 10-representation. The converse however does not hold - whenever q has a 5 in its prime factorisation, it will have a terminating 10-representation , but not a terminating 2-representation. This is the 0.1 example mentioned by other answers.

So there we have the answer to your question - because the prime factors of 2 are a subset of the prime factors of 10, all 2-terminating numbers are 10-terminating numbers, but not vice versa. It's not about 61 versus 6.1 - it's about 10 versus 2.

As a closing note, if by some quirk people used (say) base 17 but our computers used base 5, your intuition would never have been led astray by this - there would be no (non-zero, non-integer) numbers which terminated in both cases!

Baleful answered 8/7, 2009 at 8:54 Comment(6)
So then why does "alert(0.15*0.15)" display "0.0225"?Khiva
@MichaelGeiser short answer: rounding at the point of display. What you think is 0.15 is actually (when stored as an IEEE double) ` 0.149999999999999994448884876874`. See jsfiddle.Baleful
Nice clear on point code example! I wish I could give you an up vote for that! I have to play with a few functions to explore where the round up cut off occurs. I'm still just amazed that we actually have to deal with this garbage; since people work in base ten almost 100% of the time and we use non-integers so much of the time that you'd think the default implementation of floating point math would handle this nonsense.Khiva
@MichaelGeiser the circuits to work with base 2 are smaller, faster, and more power efficient than the ones to work with base 10. Today we might be able to justify the overhead but in the 1970s when the standards were being set, it was a big deal. Trying to do it without the direct support of processor circuitry is even worse, expect orders of magnitude differences in speed.Cankerous
This answer explains better than Jon Skeet himself!Boater
This answer explains how to check whether a number x has a terminating b-representation rigorously.Maniple
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The root (mathematical) reason is that when you are dealing with integers, they are countably infinite.

Which means, even though there are an infinite amount of them, we could "count out" all of the items in the sequence, without skipping any. That means if we want to get the item in the 610000000000000th position in the list, we can figure it out via a formula.

However, real numbers are uncountably infinite. You can't say "give me the real number at position 610000000000000" and get back an answer. The reason is because, even between 0 and 1, there are an infinite number of values, when you are considering floating-point values. The same holds true for any two floating point numbers.

More info:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Countable_set

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uncountable_set

Update: My apologies, I appear to have misinterpreted the question. My response is about why we cannot represent every real value, I hadn't realized that floating point was automatically classified as rational.

Demission answered 6/7, 2009 at 20:22 Comment(6)
Actually, rational numbers are countably infinite. But not every real number is a rational number. I can certainly produce a sequence of exact decimal numbers which will reach any exact decimal number you want to give me eventually. It's if you need to deal with irrational numbers as well that you get into uncountably infinite sets.Christinachristine
True, I should be saying "real", not "floating-point". Will clarify.Demission
At which point the logic becomes less applicable, IMO - because not only can we not deal with all real numbers using binary floating point, but we can't even deal with all rational numbers (such as 0.1). In other words, I don't think it's really to do with countability at all :)Christinachristine
@jonskeet I know that disagreeing with Jon Skeet would break a fundamental law of nature, so of course I won't do it :) However, I do think that it is okay to think of the internal representation of the numbers as indices to a set of the values that you want to represent externally. With this line of thinking, you can see that no matter how big your list of indices is (even if you had say, infinite bits of precision), you still wouldn't be able to represent all the real numbers.Demission
@TM: But the OP isn't trying to represent all the real numbers. He's trying to represent all exact decimal numbers, which is a subset of the rational numbers, and therefore only countably infinite. If he were using an infinite set of bits as a decimal floating point type then he'd be fine. It's using those bits as a binary floating point type that causes problems with decimal numbers.Christinachristine
@molf that's a really good point. I guess I was misinterpreting the question as "why can't we represent any fractional value when we can represent any integer value".Demission
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To repeat what I said in my comment to Mr. Skeet: we can represent 1/3, 1/9, 1/27, or any rational in decimal notation. We do it by adding an extra symbol. For example, a line over the digits that repeat in the decimal expansion of the number. What we need to represent decimal numbers as a sequence of binary numbers are 1) a sequence of binary numbers, 2) a radix point, and 3) some other symbol to indicate the repeating part of the sequence.

Hehner's quote notation is a way of doing this. He uses a quote symbol to represent the repeating part of the sequence. The article: http://www.cs.toronto.edu/~hehner/ratno.pdf and the Wikipedia entry: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quote_notation.

There's nothing that says we can't add a symbol to our representation system, so we can represent decimal rationals exactly using binary quote notation, and vice versa.

Dulin answered 25/9, 2009 at 14:36 Comment(3)
That notation system works if we know where the cycle starts and ends. Humans are pretty good at detecting cycles. But, in general, computers aren't. To use be able to use a repetition symbol effectively, the computer would have to be able to figure out where the cycles are after doing a calculation. For the number 1/3, for example, the cycle starts right away. But for the number 1/97, the cycle doesn't show itself until you've worked out the answer to at least 96 digits. (Actually, you'd need 96*2+1 = 193 digits to be sure.)Cornstarch
Actually it's not hard at all for the computer to detect the cycle. If you read Hehner's paper he describes how to detect the cycles for the various arithmetic operations. For example, in the division algorithm, which uses repeated subtraction, you know where the cycle begins when you see a difference that you have seen before.Dulin
Also, the question was about representing numbers exactly. Sometimes exact representation means a lot of bits. The beauty of quote notation is that Hehner demonstrates that on average there is a 31% saving in the size of representation compared to the standard 32-bit fixed-length representation.Dulin
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6

BCD - Binary-coded Decimal - representations are exact. They are not very space-efficient, but that's a trade-off you have to make for accuracy in this case.

Johnajohnath answered 6/7, 2009 at 20:21 Comment(2)
BCD are no more or less exact than any other base. Example: how do you represent 1/3 exactly in BCD? You can't.Aspinwall
BCD is an exact representation of a DECIMAL, thus the, um, "decimal" part of its name. There is no exact decimal representation of 1/3 either.Johnajohnath
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(Note: I'll append 'b' to indicate binary numbers here. All other numbers are given in decimal)

One way to think about things is in terms of something like scientific notation. We're used to seeing numbers expressed in scientific notation like, 6.022141 * 10^23. Floating point numbers are stored internally using a similar format - mantissa and exponent, but using powers of two instead of ten.

Your 61.0 could be rewritten as 1.90625 * 2^5, or 1.11101b * 2^101b with the mantissa and exponents. To multiply that by ten and (move the decimal point), we can do:

(1.90625 * 2^5) * (1.25 * 2^3) = (2.3828125 * 2^8) = (1.19140625 * 2^9)

or in with the mantissa and exponents in binary:

(1.11101b * 2^101b) * (1.01b * 2^11b) = (10.0110001b * 2^1000b) = (1.00110001b * 2^1001b)

Note what we did there to multiply the numbers. We multiplied the mantissas and added the exponents. Then, since the mantissa ended greater than two, we normalized the result by bumping the exponent. It's just like when we adjust the exponent after doing an operation on numbers in decimal scientific notation. In each case, the values that we worked with had a finite representation in binary, and so the values output by the basic multiplication and addition operations also produced values with a finite representation.

Now, consider how we'd divide 61 by 10. We'd start by dividing the mantissas, 1.90625 and 1.25. In decimal, this gives 1.525, a nice short number. But what is this if we convert it to binary? We'll do it the usual way -- subtracting out the largest power of two whenever possible, just like converting integer decimals to binary, but we'll use negative powers of two:

1.525         - 1*2^0   --> 1
0.525         - 1*2^-1  --> 1
0.025         - 0*2^-2  --> 0
0.025         - 0*2^-3  --> 0
0.025         - 0*2^-4  --> 0
0.025         - 0*2^-5  --> 0
0.025         - 1*2^-6  --> 1
0.009375      - 1*2^-7  --> 1
0.0015625     - 0*2^-8  --> 0
0.0015625     - 0*2^-9  --> 0
0.0015625     - 1*2^-10 --> 1
0.0005859375  - 1*2^-11 --> 1
0.00009765625...

Uh oh. Now we're in trouble. It turns out that 1.90625 / 1.25 = 1.525, is a repeating fraction when expressed in binary: 1.11101b / 1.01b = 1.10000110011...b Our machines only have so many bits to hold that mantissa and so they'll just round the fraction and assume zeroes beyond a certain point. The error you see when you divide 61 by 10 is the difference between:

1.100001100110011001100110011001100110011...b * 2^10b
and, say:
1.100001100110011001100110b * 2^10b

It's this rounding of the mantissa that leads to the loss of precision that we associate with floating point values. Even when the mantissa can be expressed exactly (e.g., when just adding two numbers), we can still get numeric loss if the mantissa needs too many digits to fit after normalizing the exponent.

We actually do this sort of thing all the time when we round decimal numbers to a manageable size and just give the first few digits of it. Because we express the result in decimal it feels natural. But if we rounded a decimal and then converted it to a different base, it'd look just as ugly as the decimals we get due to floating point rounding.

Woodrum answered 6/7, 2009 at 21:57 Comment(0)
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5

This is a good question.

All your question is based on "how do we represent a number?"

ALL the numbers can be represented with decimal representation or with binary (2's complement) representation. All of them !!

BUT some (most of them) require infinite number of elements ("0" or "1" for the binary position, or "0", "1" to "9" for the decimal representation).

Like 1/3 in decimal representation (1/3 = 0.3333333... <- with an infinite number of "3")

Like 0.1 in binary ( 0.1 = 0.00011001100110011.... <- with an infinite number of "0011")

Everything is in that concept. Since your computer can only consider finite set of digits (decimal or binary), only some numbers can be exactly represented in your computer...

And as said Jon, 3 is a prime number which isn't a factor of 10, so 1/3 cannot be represented with a finite number of elements in base 10.

Even with arithmetic with arbitrary precision, the numbering position system in base 2 is not able to fully describe 6.1, although it can represent 61.

For 6.1, we must use another representation (like decimal representation, or IEEE 854 that allows base 2 or base 10 for the representation of floating-point values)

Rissole answered 6/7, 2009 at 22:18 Comment(2)
You could represent 1/3 as the fraction itself. You don't need an infinite amount of bits to represent it. You just represent it as the fraction 1/3, instead of the result of taking 1 and dividing it by 3. Several systems works that way. You then need a way to use the standard / * + - and similar operators to work on the representation of fractions, but that's pretty easy - you can do those operations with a pen and paper, teaching a computer to do it is no big deal.Carmon
I was talking about "binary (2's complement) representation". Because, of course, using an other representation may help you to represent some number with finite number of elements (and you will need infinite number of elements for some others)Rissole
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If you make a big enough number with floating point (as it can do exponents), then you'll end up with inexactness in front of the decimal point, too. So I don't think your question is entirely valid because the premise is wrong; it's not the case that shifting by 10 will always create more precision, because at some point the floating point number will have to use exponents to represent the largeness of the number and will lose some precision that way as well.

Playpen answered 6/7, 2009 at 20:20 Comment(0)
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It's the same reason you cannot represent 1/3 exactly in base 10, you need to say 0.33333(3). In binary it is the same type of problem but just occurs for different set of numbers.

Apoplexy answered 6/7, 2009 at 20:30 Comment(0)
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I'm surprised no one has stated this yet: use continued fractions. Any rational number can be represented finitely in binary this way.

Some examples:

1/3 (0.3333...)

0; 3

5/9 (0.5555...)

0; 1, 1, 4

10/43 (0.232558139534883720930...)

0; 4, 3, 3

9093/18478 (0.49209871198181621387596060179673...)

0; 2, 31, 7, 8, 5

From here, there are a variety of known ways to store a sequence of integers in memory.

In addition to storing your number with perfect accuracy, continued fractions also have some other benefits, such as best rational approximation. If you decide to terminate the sequence of numbers in a continued fraction early, the remaining digits (when recombined to a fraction) will give you the best possible fraction. This is how approximations to pi are found:

Pi's continued fraction:

3; 7, 15, 1, 292 ...

Terminating the sequence at 1, this gives the fraction:

355/113

which is an excellent rational approximation.

Zacatecas answered 3/1, 2011 at 14:49 Comment(1)
But how would you represent that in binary? For example 15 requires 4 bits to be represented but 292 requires 9. How does the hardware (or even the software) know where the bit boundaries are between each? It's the efficiency versus accuracy tradeoff.Aphesis
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In the equation

2^x = y ;  
x = log(y) / log(2)

Hence, I was just wondering if we could have a logarithmic base system for binary like,

 2^1, 2^0, 2^(log(1/2) / log(2)), 2^(log(1/4) / log(2)), 2^(log(1/8) / log(2)),2^(log(1/16) / log(2)) ........

That might be able to solve the problem, so if you wanted to write something like 32.41 in binary, that would be

2^5 + 2^(log(0.4) / log(2)) + 2^(log(0.01) / log(2))

Or

2^5 + 2^(log(0.41) / log(2))
Pledgee answered 22/2, 2014 at 14:41 Comment(0)
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You can't represent 0.1 exactly in binary for the same reason you can't measure a tenth of an inch using a conventional English ruler.

English rulers, like binary fractions, are all about halves. You can measure half an inch, or a quarter of an inch (which is of course half of a half), or an eighth, or a sixteenth, etc.

If you want to exactly measure a tenth of an inch, though, you're out of luck. It's less than an eighth of an inch, but more than a sixteenth. If you try to get more exact, you'll find that it's a little more than 3/32, but a little less than 7/64. I've never seen an actual ruler that had gradations finer than 64ths, but if you do the math, you'll find that 1/10 is less than 13/128, and it's more than 25/256, and it's more than 51/512. You can keep going finer and finer, to 1024ths and 2048ths and 4096ths and 8192nds, but you will never find an explicit marking, even on an infinitely-fine base-2 ruler, that exactly corresponds to 1/10, or 0.1.

You will find something interesting, though. Let's look at all the approximations I've listed, and for each one, record explicitly whether 0.1 is less or greater:

fraction decimal 0.1 is... as 0/1
1/2 0.5 less 0
1/4 0.25 less 0
1/8 0.125 less 0
1/16 0.0625 greater 1
3/32 0.09375 greater 1
7/64 0.109375 less 0
13/128 0.1015625 less 0
25/256 0.09765625 greater 1
51/512 0.099609375 greater 1
103/1024 0.1005859375 less 0
205/2048 0.10009765625 less 0
409/4096 0.099853515625 greater 1
819/8192 0.0999755859375 greater 1

Now, if you read down the last column, you get 0001100110011. It's no coincidence that the infinitely-repeating binary fraction for 1/10 is 0.0001100110011...

Paolo answered 10/11, 2021 at 12:40 Comment(0)
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The problem is that you do not really know whether the number actually is exactly 61.0 . Consider this:


float a = 60;
float b = 0.1;
float c = a + b * 10;

What is the value of c? It is not exactly 61, because b is not really .1 because .1 does not have an exact binary representation.

Documentary answered 6/7, 2009 at 20:21 Comment(0)
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The number 61.0 does indeed have an exact floating-point operation—but that's not true for all integers. If you wrote a loop that added one to both a double-precision floating point number and a 64-bit integer, eventually you'd reach a point where the 64-bit integer perfectly represents a number, but the floating point doesn't—because there aren't enough significant bits.

It's just much easier to reach the point of approximation on the right side of the decimal point. If you started writing out all the numbers in binary floating point, it'd make more sense.

Another way of thinking about it is that when you note that 61.0 is perfectly representable in base 10, and shifting the decimal point around doesn't change that, you're performing multiplication by powers of ten (10^1, 10^-1). In floating point, multiplying by powers of two does not affect the precision of the number. Try taking 61.0 and dividing it by three repeatedly for an illustration of how a perfectly precise number can lose its precise representation.

Lauretta answered 6/7, 2009 at 20:24 Comment(0)
C
1

There's a threshold because the meaning of the digit has gone from integer to non-integer. To represent 61, you have 6*10^1 + 1*10^0; 10^1 and 10^0 are both integers. 6.1 is 6*10^0 + 1*10^-1, but 10^-1 is 1/10, which is definitely not an integer. That's how you end up in Inexactville.

Cankerous answered 6/7, 2009 at 20:48 Comment(0)
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1

A parallel can be made of fractions and whole numbers. Some fractions eg 1/7 cannot be represented in decimal form without lots and lots of decimals. Because floating point is binary based the special cases change but the same sort of accuracy problems present themselves.

Ezekielezell answered 6/7, 2009 at 21:3 Comment(0)
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0

There are an infinite number of rational numbers, and a finite number of bits with which to represent them. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Floating_point#Accuracy_problems.

Orthoepy answered 6/7, 2009 at 20:33 Comment(3)
But even with an infinite number of bits, if you used a floating binary point, you still wouldn't be able to represent 0.1 exactly, just like you can't represent 1/3 exactly in decimal even with an infinite number of bits.Christinachristine
@Jon That's untrue: with an infinite number of decimals, I can for example express 'one third' exactly. The real-world problem is that not physically possible to have "an infinite number" of decimals or of bits.Desert
For those just joining, see the Wikipedia article on 0.9999999999...Paolo
D
0

you know integer numbers right? each bit represent 2^n


2^4=16
2^3=8
2^2=4
2^1=2
2^0=1

well its the same for floating point(with some distinctions) but the bits represent 2^-n 2^-1=1/2=0.5
2^-2=1/(2*2)=0.25
2^-3=0.125
2^-4=0.0625

Floating point binary representation:

sign  Exponent    Fraction(i think invisible 1 is appended to the fraction )
B11  B10 B9 B8   B7 B6 B5 B4 B3 B2 B1 B0

Disparagement answered 6/7, 2009 at 21:11 Comment(0)
D
0

The high scoring answer above nailed it.

First you were mixing base 2 and base 10 in your question, then when you put a number on the right side that is not divisible into the base you get problems. Like 1/3 in decimal because 3 doesnt go into a power of 10 or 1/5 in binary which doesnt go into a power of 2.

Another comment though NEVER use equal with floating point numbers, period. Even if it is an exact representation there are some numbers in some floating point systems that can be accurately represented in more than one way (IEEE is bad about this, it is a horrible floating point spec to start with, so expect headaches). No different here 1/3 is not EQUAL to the number on your calculator 0.3333333, no matter how many 3's there are to the right of the decimal point. It is or can be close enough but is not equal. so you would expect something like 2*1/3 to not equal 2/3 depending on the rounding. Never use equal with floating point.

Dermott answered 10/7, 2009 at 21:18 Comment(0)
M
0

As we have been discussing, in floating point arithmetic, the decimal 0.1 cannot be perfectly represented in binary.

Floating point and integer representations provide grids or lattices for the numbers represented. As arithmetic is done, the results fall off the grid and have to be put back onto the grid by rounding. Example is 1/10 on a binary grid.

If we use binary coded decimal representation as one gentleman suggested, would we be able to keep numbers on the grid?

Madel answered 15/2, 2011 at 8:53 Comment(1)
Decimal numbers, sure. But that's just by definition. You can't represent 1/3 in decimal, any more than you can represent 0.1 in binary. Any quantization scheme fails for an infinitely large set of numbers.Entwine
C
0

For a simple answer: The computer doesn't have infinite memory to store fraction (after representing the decimal number as the form of scientific notation). According to IEEE 754 standard for double-precision floating-point numbers, we only have a limit of 53 bits to store fraction. For more info: http://mathcenter.oxford.emory.edu/site/cs170/ieee754/

Cockeyed answered 23/9, 2020 at 13:51 Comment(0)
T
0

I will not bother to repeat what the other 20 answers have already summarized, so I will just answer briefly:

The answer in your content:

Why can't base two numbers represent certain ratios exactly?

For the same reason that decimals are insufficient to represent certain ratios, namely, irreducible fractions with denominators containing prime factors other than two or five which will always have an indefinite string in at least the mantissa of its decimal expansion.

Why can't decimal numbers be represented exactly in binary?

This question at face value is based on a misconception regarding values themselves. No number system is sufficient to represent any quantity or ratio in a manner that the thing itself tells you that it is both a quantity, and at the same time also gives the interpretation in and of itself about the intrinsic value of the representation. As such, all quantitative representations, and models in general, are symbolic and can only be understood a posteriori, namely, after one has been taught how to read and interpret these numbers.

Since models are subjective things that are true insofar as they reflect reality, we do not strictly need to interpret a binary string as sums of negative and positive powers of two. Instead, one may observe that we can create an arbitrary set of symbols that use base two or any other base to represent any number or ratio exactly. Just consider that we can refer to all of infinity using a single word and even a single symbol without "showing infinity" itself.

As an example, I am designing a binary encoding for mixed numbers so that I can have more precision and accuracy than an IEEE 754 float. At the time of writing this, the idea is to have a sign bit, a reciprocal bit, a certain number of bits for a scalar to determine how much to "magnify" the fractional portion, and then the remaining bits are divided evenly between the integer portion of a mixed number, and the latter a fixed-point number which, if the reciprocal bit is set, should be interpreted as one divided by that number. This has the benefit of allowing me to represent numbers with infinite decimal expansions by using their reciprocals which do have terminating decimal expansions, or alternatively, as a fraction directly, potentially as an approximation, depending on my needs.

Trude answered 8/7, 2021 at 20:37 Comment(0)

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